Summary
Joe and Brett present a coaching session with commentary, pausing to analyze the patterns as they emerge. A woman comes feeling stuck and scared to take risks. Joe immediately notices that by showing up and taking the risk of being coached publicly, she’s demonstrating she’s not actually stuck — the stuckness is a feeling and an identity, not her reality.
The coaching reveals that stuckness is actually the resistance to feeling, not the feeling itself. When guided to feel more stuck, the woman discovers that her body wants to escape the feeling — and that wanting to escape IS the stuckness. When she allows herself to fall into the “black hole” she’s been avoiding, she passes right through it and comes out the other side. The avoidance of the abyss is the stuckness, not the abyss itself. They also explore how loneliness, when fully investigated, reveals itself as love — big, overwhelming love that threatens identity.
Joe and Brett discuss how the stories we tell about our patterns often ARE the patterns, and how seeing a pattern means you’re already halfway through it. They also note the common tendency to beat yourself up after an epiphany for not having seen it sooner, which slows transformation.
Key Concepts
- Stuck is a feeling, not reality
- Avoidance is the stuckness, not the feeling
- The abyss you avoid is your freedom
- Loneliness fully felt is love
- Seeing a pattern means you’re halfway through
- Self-attack after epiphany slows transformation
Key Quotes
“There’s a thing about all of our patterns where we tell ourselves we have this problem but often times that’s an old story that we used to have or it’s a way that we tell ourselves and we don’t really look to see if it’s true or not.”
“She’s here asking me a question which tells me she’s not stuck. She’s taking action which means she’s not stuck. And she’s taking a risk by coming here.”
“The avoidance of the hole is the stuckness.”
“The thing that we’re avoiding is usually the most direct path to our freedom.”
“If you find yourself in a pattern and you realize oh I’m in this pattern — it’s inevitable that you will get to the other side of it. Because if you can see it, you’re already halfway through it.”
“It feels like if I connect to it like it might absorb me whole — it will. That’s what love does. It rips away our identity.”
Transcript
there’s a thing about all of our patterns where we tell ourselves we have this problem but often times that’s an old story that we used to have or it’s a way that we tell ourselves and we don’t really look to see if it’s true or not we’ve done a lot of Rapid Fire sessions where Joe has done rapid fire coaching for people in our courses and recently started doing them for the public uh and graciously people have agreed to allow us to record those sessions and use them in podcasts so so today we’re going to run an experiment uh with one of those sessions cool so so first of all yeah I agree thanks for everybody who’s willing to take the risk to do these rapid fire coachings and allow themselves to be seen in this way so publicly I think it’s I mean it’s it’s awesome so uh thank you for all the people who did that and then what do you want to do with our time today Brett like how do what’s the experiment we’re running yeah so the experiment here is I’m going to play the session and we’re going to pause the session and talk about it whenever we see something CU whenever whenever you’re doing coaching and you know a lot of times like an epiph will happen and will be in it emotionally with the person with you in this process but then a million questions come to mind about like what was actually seen there what was the pattern here how how did you see that and you know what what else could we could we uh Harvest from this in a in a more General sense to apply it to our own life cool I’m I I think that’s a great idea that the one place that I would say I want to give warning about what we’re doing and that I don’t where the place I don’t want to go is I don’t really want to talk about the technique that I’m using I’m happy to talk about the patterns I’m happy to talk about what’s seen and how uh and like what are the pattern like what’s going on underneath and what we’re seeing and that kind of thing and but what I noticed is that there’s there’s like a certain number of people out there who very much want to be able to do what I do or something like the way that I do it not a lot of people but some people and my answer to them isn’t don’t watch this and look for my technique that’s a horrible way to go and also somewhat dangerous way to go what’s far more important is to um just work on your own self-discovery understand yourself deeply and all everything else will come to pass um rather than I think what typically people do is that they think it’s like some skill to learn and though there is some skill to it the essence of what I’m doing can’t be done without really taking a lot of time and looking at yourself and experimenting and really working on your own self-awareness so start there if you want to do this start with your own self-awareness and spend years and years and years and years on that yeah yeah beautiful and I’d also add just that like what we’re doing here is you know this is coaching this isn’t diagnosing or treating anything mental illness related this is just an exploration of what someone’s experience is in the moment and the the invitation and why we bring this to the podcast is for others to learn from that and experiment in their own experience not to as as as you just said learn a new technique that they can use on someone else this is for uh this is kind of fodder for your own self-inquiry and yes uh the intention of the conversation around the session that we’re going to have is just to help illuminate further Paths of exploration that’s right yeah see if see if you can see the patterns that are happening here how they happen in you so that’s great yeah fantastic let’s do it awesome let’s do it okay wait hold on hold on hold on before we start what are we looking at give me like a little summary I do a lot of these so I have a hard time remembering what are what are we looking at yeah so the session we’re about to um about to watch is uh with a woman who came feeling stuck she started to feel stuck around fear of taking risks in her life ah okay great great all right and here we go yeah I feel um I feel scared to take the actions that I want to take and um I feel stuck because the known is more familiar how how long how what percentage of your life from 20 years old till today would that sentence be true so so can we pause yeah so I and I remember the conversation now so that it’s great and I really really enjoyed this conversation it’s just such an amazing woman um so just to say one of the main things is that like I and and that I don’t believe any of the stories that I tell and so I don’t to myself particularly or I haven’t in a long time and and or maybe there’s some left don’t get me wrong but most of them I don’t believe and so I also don’t believe the story that somebody else tells me in this world like of oh this is the problem so part of what I’m seeing is is this really the problem if I we’re looking at it she’s telling me she’s stuck um and she’s here asking me a question which tells me she’s not stuck it means that she’s not only is she not stuck because she’s taking action she might not be getting the results that she wants but she’s taking action which means she’s not stuck and she’s taking a risk by coming here and doing this all verbally so just to say right away there this problem but often times that’s an old story that we used to have or it’s a way that we tell ourselves and we don’t so immediately for her and I would say for most folks who come and do something with me immediately the question that arises is is this really the pattern or is this the story We Tell around the pattern right yeah and this this is something that you know that I’ve learned through coaching as well is that you know people show up with exactly the the whole picture often in the first first few sentences of the way that they show up and this is another way of kind of seeing how you know if you’re working in a company oftentimes if a company or a team is stuck it’s because that the way that they have defined the problem is actually creating the stuckness and it looks like that’s kind of what’s going on here is it’s she’s brought you this the story of how she’s stuck and that story is actually the thing that is driving the feeling driving or at least re recycling that feeling of stuckness yeah so I love the question the opening question of like well how much of your you know life have you spent feeling this yeah and also what’s happening there is I’m I’m saying that this is a feeling that you might feel stuck doesn’t mean you are stuck you might feel scared doesn’t mean you’re under threat you might feel um sad but it it doesn’t mean that it’s not love that there sadness is there because of a love that you have so what we feel doesn’t mean that it’s our reality okay so let’s see let’s see what’s going on let’s continue how what percentage of your life from 20 years old till today would that sentence be true I am not happy with the state of things and I am scared to take the risk of of going into the unknown maybe 30 to 50 so I’ve taken a lot of risk um but I still keep finding myself in this space this what space of being unsatisfied with the way things are yeah feeling stuck but um feeling so terrified of making the next move that it’s more familiar and safer to be in the stuck in unhappiness oh right there I love what she just said the recognition of that it feels safer to be in the stuckness yeah so all these things are happening in her life she spends this amount of time she says in the stuckness but that it’s not necessarily that stuckness is what’s happening it’s that stuckness is where she’s going to feel safer from all the other feelings that are happening what what are you seeing there yeah exactly except the only thing I would add to that is that we we we’re safe where we’re identified so she’s also telling me at this moment she’s identified as someone who doesn’t take risks if feels stuck who’s on a regular basis unsatisfied with life so it’s safe because this is part of the identity so and she’s announcing it early on as most people do early on in the session telling us what’s really happening for for her and you can see I mean what there’s also like a tremendous amount of compassion and and I just like love that I have because I see her really wrestling with this and really wanting to have freedom from it and and and she’s clearly done a lot of work to think about it and and consider it and and she’s explored herself enough to know that she’s you know this is where she feels safe which is cool yeah yeah so so far she’s she’s come with the the story that that recreates the the painful feelings for her and then also that she sees the she sees the key yeah and so now I’m curious where this goes goes next as far as like putting the key in the in the hole and turning it so let’s see yeah again I I just want to point out that you are you just took an action of going into the unknown and proving that you’re not stuck how how’s that by being in this conversation yeah so my question is how much of this stuck is a feeling and how much of it is it actual like are you actually stuck are you actually taking the actions of a stuck person or do you just think you’re stuck I’m not sure I could identify the difference now that’s interesting to me as well there there’s like a confusion it feels like a defense to me there’s like I’m I’m curious what you see there but it feels I smile yeah yeah there’s some smile a little bit of a smile she sees it yeah but there’s something she’d have to feel to to like let that fully through let that fully be seen right so that like my perspective whenever I’m working with somebody is that they have the answers they know what’s going on and I’m following them but I’m having a conversation with the part of them that knows not the one that’s telling the story and so that smile tells me there’s something she knows there she sees something and and I’m and I’m going to want to follow that and it doesn’t mean she’s not confused it doesn’t mean everything she’s saying isn’t real and I want to take that into account but that’s but this is very typical right when you’re working with somebody what’s very typical is that they kind of see it and they kind of don’t right if they’re if they’re talking about it with me as an issue it means that they already have more Consciousness on it because it if they didn’t then wouldn’t even know to talk about it yeah y yeah yeah looking back through my life here any there’s so many situations that I felt stuck in for so long that all of them I actually knew the way out of it like you just said if I knew I was stuck or if I knew I was in a pattern I was already separated enough from the pattern to not be identified as it on some level that’s right to see that it is something that is not me that’s not mine that could be seen through that’s right a and it’s like all when somebody sees that they’re having a problem it’s inevitable that they will get through it it might take them a long time but it’s inevitable and there’s something that’s really nice if you find yourself in a pattern and you realize like oh I’m in this pattern to like it happens in my system if I I’m in a pattern there’s no question I’m going to get to the other side of it because if I’m I’m already halfway through by the time I can see it I’m halfway through it you know yeah so yeah great okay so let’s keep let’s see what happens look like a year ago very different um I was there there we go that would be not stuck um but for the last year it’s sped stuck so a lot of things in my life changed last year and oh wait I’m with you I’m not gonna but but you said you so you feel stuck you just said It felt stuck okay your looked a lot different then then it’s not actually as stuck I’m just saying are we working on the fact that you’re stuck or are we working on the fact that you feel stuck I think feeling stuck yeah yeah yeah great and how to stuck feel yeah I love the the recognition there that okay yeah it’s actually the feeling that I’m working with it’s not this it’s not the condition going on in my life which we’ve identified actually isn’t true because there’s been so much movement over the past year things are different things are changing things are evolving but yeah okay it’s the feeling of stuck and then going into that feeling I’m curious where where this goes now that she’s with that feeling or I think often times often times when people are stuck it’s because of a thought pattern it’s not because of reality and another part is that it’s like there’s also means like stuck is often like stuck in your head and so let’s get into the emotion because that’s where often times if you if you find yourself stuck often times it’s emotional movement emotional fluidity that’s going to going to actually change something it’s not figuring something out typically so so that for anybody out there who’s listening who feels stuck it’s a great thing to know like move some emotion see if you still feel stuck okay let’s see all right it feels like I’m unable to move um kind of like I’m stuck in like a mouse trap my feet are stuck to the ground great I want you to feel more stuck right now I want you to increase the feeling of stuckness okay it’s it feels like every time I try to do that my body wants to spend more energy getting out of that feeling okay yeah one thing I love right there is she’s just pointed to the fact that it’s not actually the feeling of stuckness it’s the wanting to leave the stuckness that is actually the the discomfort yes it is the I would say even more accurately it is the stuckness like it’s you have to want to get out for you to be stuck yeah right oh my God I was stuck I was stuck in heaven it sucked I wanted to get out you know what I mean like right like I was yeah stuck feeling awesome I was stuck in Joy it’s there’s a there’s a the struggle to get out is required for stuckness and so to which is what we’re doing right now is like we’re going against that um against that pattern instead of trying to get out of it let’s go right into the middle of it which is emotionally generally for anybody in any kind of emotional pattern trying to get out of the emotion is not as effective as going right into it so that’s what we’re doing here all right let’s see how that goes great I want you to go even more stuck then I want you to feel so stuck that you can’t even talk you’re so stuck you can’t even describe it to me you’re so stuck and then even more like just go even more stuck it feels like I’m going to explode yeah keep going I feel helpless yeah one thing I want to point out there is earlier she was describing the feelings in terms of what it feels like is going to happen like she just right there transferred from feels like I’m going to explode to it feels like helplessness yes which to me says that she’s more with the the raw data the raw sensation of the feeling than the implications of the feeling right or or a feeling resisted shows up as a different feeling like resisted anger feels very different than embraced anger and so this is this is what’s like in her particular case what stuckness feels like if you are not trying to get unstuck like this is the thing that’s really at the bottom of this particular pattern but there’s no bottom exactly but the next level down let’s see where it goes what just happened with that it feels like I’m G to get sucked into this black hole and never be able to come out go in go to the hole so so if we can stop for a minute I’m saying go into the hole like with Incredible Cavalier like yeah do that and she’s like I’m never going to get back out kind of the the way I would the reason that gives me such joy to be able to say jump into that crazy scary thing is that the thing that we’re avoiding is usually the most direct path to our freedom the thing where you know it’s the it’s the uh Luke Skywalker in the cave it’s you know it’s like going in and especially when you get into that place it’s like an abyss like oh my God it’s endless that that is our freedom cuz what we’re essentially scared of most is deep love deep pleasure deep freedom and so typic typically and and when I say typically I think every single scenario I’ve seen when someone really allows themselves to fall in there something beautiful is on the other side yeah and I have like the the audience in my head is asking a million questions right now about like well what what could go wrong whether whether this is somebody who’s going straight into the center of it in the presence of a coach or if it’s somebody who’s listening to this and then goes straight into the center of what they’re feeling is alone like what are if any like what are what are the pitfalls here what would be something to like how does somebody feel comfortable knowing that this that what they’re going to feel is going to bring them to their freedom they’re not going to that that it’s not like someone’s like okay go into this big black hole it’s not scary and you’re going to have freedom it’s like go to the big black hole because it’s scary right there’s no there’s like what’s on the other side of freedom is that the identity starts to crumble the idea of I’m stuck starts going away and if that’s your safe spot it’s not safe right so like I wouldn’t I wouldn’t give people the answer to that I would say let’s let’s jump in and find out what’s happening and you don’t have to like if you don’t want to don’t you’re welcome of course never to jump in and a tit trate yeah yeah all right let’s see let’s see what happens okay yeah and you’re smiling because when I went into the hole Yeah suddenly there was a different way and I just came back out again yeah that’s right that’s how it works beautiful the avoidance of the hole is the stuckness the abyss now I want to pause here for a moment as well because on one level it looks like almost nothing happened and on another level something has deeply happened here and you can see it in her face yeah uh for those of us who are watching this on on the YouTube but uh yeah I just want to I want to point to that uh what do you what do you see there what do you see that occurred in this moment Where She Went she went into it and came out on the other side it is a mix of emotions um there’s and it’s going to take a while for her to like integrate everything um there’s like a relief and there’s a sadness like I’ve been running this from this thing my whole life for no reason that’s kind of below it um but I I and and that’s like kind of the natural progression through something like this is like there’s a relief there’s a like oh my go sometimes like a huge laughter and then like oh this is ridiculous like how has this been the case and then also some sort of grief usually needs to occur but that that’ll happen over time um in this moment right now it’s kind of just mind blown what the fuck you know and and then the freedom that comes with that Epiphany it’s like stepping across the electric fence yeah being on the other side of it and not getting shocked and being like wait a minute I was afraid of this exactly exactly yeah all right let’s keep going what do I do with this what did you just do with it I just came out of it I went in and then I came out of it that’s how you do it the stuckness is the resisting it’s not the actual Abyss hole black hole give me a moment in your life when that black hole wasn’t there like maybe it’s way out in the background maybe it’s but like just notice that that’s like a you said I’m dissatisfied with life often like that tells me that big black hole Abyss is there a lot I like how One thing that’s happening here is that like what like one of one of a common pattern might be to have an experience in a coaching session and then isolate it to the session be like well that was just then that was just that one time or what do I or what do do about it yeah right yeah yeah yeah so there’s the what do I do about it and then there’s also what I love that you just did there was kind of preempted that this doesn’t apply to the rest of life like you’re looking through where else in her life has this has this been present yeah and has that escape hatch been right there yeah which is a that’s a that’s a powerful recognition yeah let’s see what she does with with it it’s great that I can’t remember is this is like it’s like I I don’t really have like I do so much of this and so many like I don’t have a distinct memory of everything so it’s kind of like a little surprise when I’m listening to it I’m like oh what happens next it’s fun yeah let’s see what she does with it it’s been present a lot in the last while yeah yeah and it’s your it’s the thing you’re looking for it is the way to be unstuck and you’ve been avoiding it I feel like the way I try to solve for it is to try and create the perfect perfect circumstances so I don’t feel it again right which keeps me in the feeling because I don’t know what those circumstances are going to be to never have this right instead of yay there’s the feeling that’s my unstuck place I another beautiful recognition that she has seen this pattern like she had that answer in her system already about how this works yeah yeah yeah I love I love what she’s doing like I love to watch that integration and her bravery is awesome yeah yeah and continuing yeah you are avoiding something that is your relief you are running away from from the thing that brings you Freedom quickest yeah I’m wondering why I do that it’s a human thing the more we avoid something that moment do you see do you see that’s a moment that’s something that happens right so somebody sees their pattern they see through it and then they beat themselves up for having the pattern I wonder why I do that like there’s some Wonder there but the question is why and there’s like the beginning of the self abuse and I say to her at that moment this is a human thing and she goes there’s nothing wrong with me I’m not fucked up right it’s but the the reason I speak it is because that’s a pattern generally for people is like one of the things we do to like slow our transformation is when we see something we have an epiphany then we beat ourselves up for not having it sooner or not when we were younger or you anything like why do I do that’s horrible that I do that instead of just like ah fuck yeah cool there’s Freedom right there yeah and on what level was this the thing that was keeping the pattern stuck because she came into the session seeing the stuckness pattern and seeing the way that that it’s a defense and if she’s not allowing herself to actually be there because she judges herself for it then she won’t allow herself to go into the into the feeling into the abyss so on some level it’s it seems to me that this self- judgment has actually been the thing that’s been holding the whole supporting the whole house of cards so to speak definitely one of the one of the pillars Yeah Yeah the more we avoid something the scarier it gets yeah and typically the thing that we’re avoiding is love in the exercise the thing that we talked about was why do I keep of why do I keep resisting the feeling of loneliness yeah let’s do that one too then okay feel the loneliness for a minute like go just like jump into the loneliness yeah no reason yeah how is that not love it feels like a disconnection and a longing more than love great so go right into the middle of the longing keep your eyes closed go right into the middle of the longing don’t disconnect from your longing be intimate with your longing it’s so big yeah love is really big I’m just loving all the smiles and laughs on her face in this this last segment like just constant like recognition like oh I see I see what the game has been all along yeah yeah beautiful I feel and again it’s the story oh and again it’s the story of like the sensation has been run away from because there’s a story that it’s loneliness so the sensation never gets fully investigated and as soon as it’s investigat it’s like it’s so big like that’s the first thing she says anyway okay yeah yeah I love that and then the exploration of like what actually is it cuz if it’s if that feeling is identified as loneliness then that also means stories like I’m alone yeah exactly I feel it’s like if I connect to it like it might absorb me whole it will that’s what love does it rips away our identity it feels like if I give into the longing I might be just like be like a little baby like totally helpless yeah that’s how it works but you don’t give into it you just be intimate with it I want control I want control and taper this feeling to my comfort level great you can do that if you want you can just like spend a little time with the longing tomorrow you can spend a little more time with the longing the next day you can paper if you’d like okay there’s no problem with that this part also looks like another important piece for once somebody’s had experience like this a recognition like this to to not go into self attack about it later to be given to give themselves permission to give ourselves permission to be like yeah sometimes I don’t want to be in the abyss sometimes I want to avoid to resist the abyss sometimes I’m just going to do that and that’s as you said earlier a totally human thing yeah and exactly and it’s okay to want to have some control or feel a sense of control over it it’s natural yeah and we don’t have any control over it but yes it’s natural to want that yeah I I mean the thing is it’s like you can either be fighting with yourself or not be fighting with yourself and it’s like you can taper no problem like just like or you can fight with yourself you know what I mean like it’s just like let the we don’t need an idea of how we should be we can be good with who we are yeah let’s see what happens I think we’re close to the end if I recall correctly you don’t get to control love that’s not how it works you just get to you just get to be heartbroken from time to time increasing your capacity to love yeah what a pleasure to work with you thank you Joe you’re so welcome thanks for coming up yeah all right yep that was it that was fun yeah I have no idea if this will actually make a good podcast episode but it was really fun to to do it yeah find out let’s see how let’s see how it goes uh I’m going to rely on our listeners to tell us what they think about this episode should we do more of these should we less of them what do you want y can tell us you can tell us on Twitter at Art of a comp or Fu Joe Hudson if you want it and what else what else should we or is there another place they can tell us they can email us at podcast artof accomplishment.com yeah um or just hit up our website and use the contact form all right yeah or if you’re on Circle and you’ve taken one of our courses you can always DM us there too that’s right all right all right well that was Funk everybody thank you thank you thank you to Our Guest who will will leave unnamed for for privacy purposes but you know who you are thank you so much this was really really amaz work yeah I really hope also if you’re if you end up watching this please let us know how this was for you to like have this analysis of your session and I really want to make sure that this is something that’s really helpful for the people that we do this with so please let us know and I want to make sure that it’s something that’s beneficial for everybody yeah all right all right thank you everybody all right take care by till next time